[Abu-Jamal v. Kerestes was an amended complaint that was filed seeking injunctive relief for prison medical staff’s failure to treat Abu-Jamal’s active hepatitis C.]
Mumia Abu-Jamal: Yeah, yeah, I mean, it’s just, this is going to be, this is going to be interesting. No matter which way it flies, it’s going to be interesting. We either going to see some sh** or we’re going to see some sh**. You hear me?
Noelle Hanrahan: I mean, it’s good to plan, because this is America.
Mumia Abu-Jamal: Yep, so anything can happen. But you know, ah, man, we could not have done better, and they could not have been crazier, and so, I mean, it’s just, you know, manna from the gods, manna from the gods. You know, I expected to actually get it next week. Lo and behold, I got my regular mail yesterday, and I saw this big brown envelope
Facility recording: This is a call from Pennsylvania State Correctional Institution Mahanoy.
Mumia Abu-Jamal: and I saw your return address on it, and I felt it, and I knew I could feel the plastic binder through the manila envelope. I just knew what it was, and when I opened it and saw the first page, I laughed out loud because the thing is beautiful. I mean, you know the actual transcript of that hearing, because I think unless you were there, you would not believe what happened. And I think the media did not give us a fair portrayal of what happened, frankly. They have their interests. We have ours. But the transcript is the transcript, and that thing is like dynamite on paper. It’s just remarkable. So I had a big belly laugh the minute I looked at it.
Noelle Hanrahan: What did it say about them, and what did it say about us, and what did it say about the judge?
Mumia Abu-Jamal: Well, it was like, in some ways, it was like the Twilight Zone, because, frankly, no matter what court we’re in, we’re, you know, we tend to be projected in the courts of American law as the bad guys. This was something else again. I got a sense from the first moment of the hearing that we were the good guys and the state was the bad guys, and they were like trying to shut this thing down with a vehemence. “No, you must, must, must dismiss this. I demand that you dismiss this.” And I remember kind of looking at the judge and listening to the judge, and he was incredulous. He was like, he didn’t say this, but this is the vibe I got from like, “Are you serious? I mean, seriously?” That’s a new sensation and…
Facility recording: This is a call from Pennsylvania State Correctional Institution, Mahanoy
Mumia Abu-Jamal: …the further we got into the hearing, and I’m talking about day one, day two, and day three, I understood why she fought so vociferously to have it dismissed, because they did not want this kind of information. I mean the secret protocol. Their doctor releasing medical information that none of us had known and had not been given through discovery; the complete emptiness of the state’s witnesses. I mean, it was like, it was like watching a television movie, except this ain’t fiction, y’all, this is real life.
Noelle Hanrahan: It was like the unpeeling of what actually happens in the bowels of these– These guys never — prisoners, never get to court. They never have to defend themselves, the state. But this was like this window into this world.
Mumia Abu-Jamal: It was more than that, and I’ll tell you why. You’re right that most prisoners file suits pro se and therefore never actually get in front of a judge with a beating heart, a live judge. It’s done on paper. What that means is the state can do anything on paper; lie, cheat, falsify documents, and it never gets discovered because they don’t send you discovery, as the rules say you must. You you don’t have an opportunity to cross examine the person on the affidavit, as most lawyers do, and jailhouse lawyers are not able to do because you’re on the paper. So, you know, judges read that stuff and say, “Okay, no, look, this looks good, it’s okay.” Which is what happened before the magistrate. We had no hearing. It was just done through the mail, essentially. Lo and behold, when we put the witness on the stand and he says, “No, that that’s not my signature. Hey, I didn’t sign this.” I’m like, I think everybody in the courtroom was flabbergasted, like, “Whoa, whoa what is this?” Because no one knew until it happened. So, that’s the benefit of a hearing. You get to hear things that you would never see written on paper. It was remarkable.
Noelle Hanrahan: Like it’s 50 or 60 bucks to make that copy, because if I made them in bulk, so if people want them, I’m giving them out like candy and I put them up on the website as well.
Mumia Abu-Jamal: You put in the whole transcript?
Noelle Hanrahan: Yeah, I put it ..
Mumia Abu-Jamal: Wow!
Noelle Hanrahan: Yes.
Mumia Abu-Jamal: Brilliant, because — that is brilliant, because people, other people can see. Wonderful. Thank you. I mean, I, I was wondering if someone was going to do that, and I’m glad, so glad because, you know, buy it or not, now you can go up and read it without buying, right?
Noelle Hanrahan: Exactly.
Mumia Abu-Jamal: You can read it for yourself, and then give us a call let us know what you think. (laughing) All right.
Noelle Hanrahan: Alright. Take care. Bye.
Mumia Abu-Jamal: Bye.
These commentaries are recorded by Noelle Hanrahan of Prison Radio.
